StarZero All shows Try the podcast clipper →

Jun 23, 2017 · 22m · 20vc

20VC: Why Every CEO's Goal Should Be To Be The Laziest CEO, The Benefits of Being Both Founder and Investor At The Same Time & Why Every CEO Should Try A CEO Coach with Bart Lorang, Founder & CEO @ Full Contact

Bart Lorang · 14m spoken Harry Stebbings · 7m spoken
0:00 / 0:00

gold bands on the timeline = statements, start to end. Hover to read, click to jump. CC turns on captions

In this episode of The 20 Minute VC, host Harry Stebbings interviews Bart Lorang, founder and CEO of Full Contact and Managing Director at VOne VC. Lorang shares insights on building a startup, balancing investing with operating, prioritizing CEO coaching and employee wellness, and cultivating a culture centered on delegation.

How this conversation actually went

Every chapter scored 0–10 on four independent dynamics. Hover any point for the reasoning behind the score. Harry holds 33.3% of the talking time here. How this is scored →

Harry as informed peer 1.8 Guest teaching 2.0 Guest disagreement 0.3 Harry pushing back 1.3
05100:0010:0020:002:17–4:51 · Harry as informed peer 1/10 The Founding Story of Full Contact Harry asks a standard introductory question about Full Contact's founding story. Bart shares the narrative of inspecting his wife's Outlook contacts and launching Rainmaker.4:52–7:15 · Harry as informed peer 2/10 Balancing Roles as Founder and Seed Investor Harry asks a helpful follow-up asking Bart to explain what he means by capital allocation. Bart reframes scaling a startup as portfolio management and discusses the emotional coaching aspect of seed investing.7:16–11:10 · Harry as informed peer 2/10 CEO Coaching, Personal Development, and Headspace Harry prompts Bart on his relationship with CEO coach Jerry Colonna and asks if all CEOs should hire one. Bart candidly shares a story about feeling overwhelmed during a snow shoveling incident and advocates allocating 10% of salary toward personal development.11:10–15:22 · Harry as informed peer 4/10 The Art of Dealmaking and Long-Term Relationships This segment features the strongest dynamic interaction. Bart reframes Harry's premise that he is a 'great negotiator' by stating he actually considers himself a poor negotiator focused on dealmaking. Harry pushes back twice—first citing Box CSO Jitu Patel's 30% value rule, and then pressing Bart to explicitly answer how to spot short-term transactional behavior.15:22–17:33 · Harry as informed peer 1/10 Full Contact's 'Paid-Paid Vacation' Policy Harry inquires about Full Contact's $7,500 'paid-paid vacation' policy. Bart outlines the rules and benefits of forcing employees to digitally detox.17:33–21:03 · Harry as informed peer 1/10 Quickfire Round: Success, Vulnerability, and the 'Lazy CEO' In a quickfire format, Harry asks rapid questions while Bart responds on subjects ranging from Neil Armstrong to his goal of becoming a 'lazy CEO.'2:17–4:51 · Guest teaching 1/10 The Founding Story of Full Contact Harry asks a standard introductory question about Full Contact's founding story. Bart shares the narrative of inspecting his wife's Outlook contacts and launching Rainmaker.4:52–7:15 · Guest teaching 3/10 Balancing Roles as Founder and Seed Investor Harry asks a helpful follow-up asking Bart to explain what he means by capital allocation. Bart reframes scaling a startup as portfolio management and discusses the emotional coaching aspect of seed investing.7:16–11:10 · Guest teaching 2/10 CEO Coaching, Personal Development, and Headspace Harry prompts Bart on his relationship with CEO coach Jerry Colonna and asks if all CEOs should hire one. Bart candidly shares a story about feeling overwhelmed during a snow shoveling incident and advocates allocating 10% of salary toward personal development.11:10–15:22 · Guest teaching 3/10 The Art of Dealmaking and Long-Term Relationships This segment features the strongest dynamic interaction. Bart reframes Harry's premise that he is a 'great negotiator' by stating he actually considers himself a poor negotiator focused on dealmaking. Harry pushes back twice—first citing Box CSO Jitu Patel's 30% value rule, and then pressing Bart to explicitly answer how to spot short-term transactional behavior.15:22–17:33 · Guest teaching 2/10 Full Contact's 'Paid-Paid Vacation' Policy Harry inquires about Full Contact's $7,500 'paid-paid vacation' policy. Bart outlines the rules and benefits of forcing employees to digitally detox.17:33–21:03 · Guest teaching 1/10 Quickfire Round: Success, Vulnerability, and the 'Lazy CEO' In a quickfire format, Harry asks rapid questions while Bart responds on subjects ranging from Neil Armstrong to his goal of becoming a 'lazy CEO.'2:17–4:51 · Guest disagreement 0/10 The Founding Story of Full Contact Harry asks a standard introductory question about Full Contact's founding story. Bart shares the narrative of inspecting his wife's Outlook contacts and launching Rainmaker.4:52–7:15 · Guest disagreement 0/10 Balancing Roles as Founder and Seed Investor Harry asks a helpful follow-up asking Bart to explain what he means by capital allocation. Bart reframes scaling a startup as portfolio management and discusses the emotional coaching aspect of seed investing.7:16–11:10 · Guest disagreement 0/10 CEO Coaching, Personal Development, and Headspace Harry prompts Bart on his relationship with CEO coach Jerry Colonna and asks if all CEOs should hire one. Bart candidly shares a story about feeling overwhelmed during a snow shoveling incident and advocates allocating 10% of salary toward personal development.11:10–15:22 · Guest disagreement 2/10 The Art of Dealmaking and Long-Term Relationships This segment features the strongest dynamic interaction. Bart reframes Harry's premise that he is a 'great negotiator' by stating he actually considers himself a poor negotiator focused on dealmaking. Harry pushes back twice—first citing Box CSO Jitu Patel's 30% value rule, and then pressing Bart to explicitly answer how to spot short-term transactional behavior.15:22–17:33 · Guest disagreement 0/10 Full Contact's 'Paid-Paid Vacation' Policy Harry inquires about Full Contact's $7,500 'paid-paid vacation' policy. Bart outlines the rules and benefits of forcing employees to digitally detox.17:33–21:03 · Guest disagreement 0/10 Quickfire Round: Success, Vulnerability, and the 'Lazy CEO' In a quickfire format, Harry asks rapid questions while Bart responds on subjects ranging from Neil Armstrong to his goal of becoming a 'lazy CEO.'2:17–4:51 · Harry pushing back 0/10 The Founding Story of Full Contact Harry asks a standard introductory question about Full Contact's founding story. Bart shares the narrative of inspecting his wife's Outlook contacts and launching Rainmaker.4:52–7:15 · Harry pushing back 2/10 Balancing Roles as Founder and Seed Investor Harry asks a helpful follow-up asking Bart to explain what he means by capital allocation. Bart reframes scaling a startup as portfolio management and discusses the emotional coaching aspect of seed investing.7:16–11:10 · Harry pushing back 1/10 CEO Coaching, Personal Development, and Headspace Harry prompts Bart on his relationship with CEO coach Jerry Colonna and asks if all CEOs should hire one. Bart candidly shares a story about feeling overwhelmed during a snow shoveling incident and advocates allocating 10% of salary toward personal development.11:10–15:22 · Harry pushing back 4/10 The Art of Dealmaking and Long-Term Relationships This segment features the strongest dynamic interaction. Bart reframes Harry's premise that he is a 'great negotiator' by stating he actually considers himself a poor negotiator focused on dealmaking. Harry pushes back twice—first citing Box CSO Jitu Patel's 30% value rule, and then pressing Bart to explicitly answer how to spot short-term transactional behavior.15:22–17:33 · Harry pushing back 1/10 Full Contact's 'Paid-Paid Vacation' Policy Harry inquires about Full Contact's $7,500 'paid-paid vacation' policy. Bart outlines the rules and benefits of forcing employees to digitally detox.17:33–21:03 · Harry pushing back 0/10 Quickfire Round: Success, Vulnerability, and the 'Lazy CEO' In a quickfire format, Harry asks rapid questions while Bart responds on subjects ranging from Neil Armstrong to his goal of becoming a 'lazy CEO.'

speaking balance: gold is Harry, purple is the guest (3 minute bins)

0:00 · Harry 82.2% · guest 17.8%0:00 · Harry 82.2% · guest 17.8%3:00 · Harry 14.2% · guest 85.8%3:00 · Harry 14.2% · guest 85.8%6:00 · Harry 18.8% · guest 81.2%6:00 · Harry 18.8% · guest 81.2%9:00 · Harry 21% · guest 79%9:00 · Harry 21% · guest 79%12:00 · Harry 30.1% · guest 69.9%12:00 · Harry 30.1% · guest 69.9%15:00 · Harry 20.9% · guest 79.1%15:00 · Harry 20.9% · guest 79.1%18:00 · Harry 10.4% · guest 89.6%18:00 · Harry 10.4% · guest 89.6%21:00 · Harry 95.7% · guest 4.3%21:00 · Harry 95.7% · guest 4.3%
Sharpest disagreement ▶ 11:17 Rejecting the 'great negotiator' premise

Bart explicitly rejects Harry's framing that he is a master negotiator, clarifying that he actually considers himself a poor negotiator who focuses on creative win-win dealmaking instead.

 Hardest push from Harry ▶ 14:29 Refusing a dodged question on relationship signs

When Bart gives a general statement about avoiding transactional relationships instead of answering how to identify them, Harry interrupts to restate and press his question directly.

 Biggest teaching moment ▶ 6:10 Explaining capital allocation in scaling startups

Bart educates Harry on how a scaling CEO's core function transitions into capital allocation and portfolio management, drawing a direct parallel to seed stage investing.

 Harry holds his own ▶ 12:42 Citing Box CSO's 30% monetization model

Harry brings up Box CSO Jitu Patel's philosophy that companies should only capture 30% of the value they generate, challenging Bart to defend his pricing dynamic.
the scores for every segment, with the reasoning behind each
ChapterTopicHarry as informed peerGuest teachingGuest disagreementHarry pushing backWhy
The Founding Story of Full Contact 1100 Harry asks a standard introductory question about Full Contact's founding story. Bart shares the narrative of inspecting his wife's Outlook contacts and launching Rainmaker.
Balancing Roles as Founder and Seed Investor 2302 Harry asks a helpful follow-up asking Bart to explain what he means by capital allocation. Bart reframes scaling a startup as portfolio management and discusses the emotional coaching aspect of seed investing.
CEO Coaching, Personal Development, and Headspace 2201 Harry prompts Bart on his relationship with CEO coach Jerry Colonna and asks if all CEOs should hire one. Bart candidly shares a story about feeling overwhelmed during a snow shoveling incident and advocates allocating 10% of salary toward personal development.
The Art of Dealmaking and Long-Term Relationships 4324 This segment features the strongest dynamic interaction. Bart reframes Harry's premise that he is a 'great negotiator' by stating he actually considers himself a poor negotiator focused on dealmaking. Harry pushes back twice—first citing Box CSO Jitu Patel's 30% value rule, and then pressing Bart to explicitly answer how to spot short-term transactional behavior.
Full Contact's 'Paid-Paid Vacation' Policy 1201 Harry inquires about Full Contact's $7,500 'paid-paid vacation' policy. Bart outlines the rules and benefits of forcing employees to digitally detox.
Quickfire Round: Success, Vulnerability, and the 'Lazy CEO' 1100 In a quickfire format, Harry asks rapid questions while Bart responds on subjects ranging from Neil Armstrong to his goal of becoming a 'lazy CEO.'

Statements from this episode (12)

Insight
Lorang: Coaching other founders reveals hidden flaws in your own company
“The act of, like, coaching somebody else to a problem sometimes reveals things inside your own company that are screwed up, and we all have things that are screwed up.”
Bart Lorang Jun 23, 2017 ▶ 5:54
Insight
Lorang: Scaling a startup shifts the CEO's job to capital allocation
“As a CEO, as your company grows and scales, your job becomes more about capital allocation and where you're placing your bets, right?”
Bart Lorang Jun 23, 2017 ▶ 6:11
Insight
Lorang: CEOs must spend 10% of their salary on personal growth
“If you're not spending 10% of your salary every year in your company on your own personal growth and development, like you're literally suboptimizing the company.”
Bart Lorang Jun 23, 2017 ▶ 9:10
Insight
Lorang: CEOs should only schedule 50% of their work calendars
“So my rule of thumb is only schedule 50% of your calendar. Don't schedule 40 hours a week of meetings.”
Bart Lorang Jun 23, 2017 ▶ 10:50
Insight
Lorang: Early-stage deals relying on marginal IRR differences are bad investments
“If the IRR is 12% or 14%, and it's that close, like, it's probably not a good deal. It's got to be, like, no-brainer stuff that is just like, oh, if it works. If it doesn't, it's a zero.”
Bart Lorang Jun 23, 2017 ▶ 12:25
Insight
Lorang: Companies should capture over 50% of the value they create
“I don't know if I agree with that. I think that it should be over 50% if you had to put me, pay me to a number. I think you'd always leave things on the table, but that's But that's, that goes to the relationship dynamics.”
Bart Lorang Jun 23, 2017 ▶ 13:35
Insight
Lorang: Sales reps leave money on table chasing quarterly commissions
“So, you know, and a lot of times sales reps do this where there, there's clearly a bigger opportunity, but they're optimizing for their commission this quarter and they're actually leaving a Big pile of money on the table because they're optimizing for their c…”
Bart Lorang Jun 23, 2017 ▶ 14:59
Assertion Supported
FullContact pays employees $7,500 annually to take fully disconnected vacations
“Paid, paid vacation is a thing that we came up with about five years ago at Full Contact, and we pay every employee 7500 dollars once a year to take a vacation, and that's on top of their existing paid vacation salary, so they get a 7500 dollar stipend to go t…”
Bart Lorang Jun 23, 2017 ▶ 15:41
Insight
Lorang: Focus and simplification can cut work hours from 70 to 35
“People realize that you don't actually have to work 70 hours. You can actually knock it out in 35 hours, maybe, and if Just actually focus and simplify and declutter.”
Bart Lorang Jun 23, 2017 ▶ 17:25
Insight
Lorang: Executive control is a myth; leaders control basically nothing
“Control is a word that we should probably eliminate. It's a falsehood that we control. We control basically nothing, and I've given up a lot of control in my company in terms of my management style is very, very hands-off, or I like to think so.”
Bart Lorang Jun 23, 2017 ▶ 19:45
Prediction Not checkable as stated
Lorang: FullContact will be public or IPO-ready by 2022
“I think in five years, right, full contact will either be a public company or ready to be public.”
Bart Lorang Jun 23, 2017 ▶ 20:27
Prediction Not checkable as stated
Lorang aims to be a lazy CEO who reads and meditates
“So my goal is to be the lazy CEO that actually just shows up every day, maybe reads, maybe meditates, maybe answers an email or two but actually doesn't have to do much.”
Bart Lorang Jun 23, 2017 ▶ 20:38
Made with StarZero

Turn any episode into a week of clips.

This entire site, over 1,200 episodes transcribed, diarized, checked and made playable, runs on the StarZero media pipeline. Drop in your own episode and the podcast clipper finds the moments worth sharing, cuts them, captions them, and reframes them for every feed.

Try the podcast clipper Learn more