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Aug 19, 2020 · 17m · founders-journal

Future of The Founder's Journal

Alex Lieberman · 12m spoken Josh Kaplan · 3m spoken
0:00 / 0:00

gold bands on the timeline = statements, start to end. Hover to read, click to jump. CC turns on captions

Morning Brew co-founder Alex Lieberman and executive collaborator Josh Kaplan conduct a strategic 63-episode audit of 'Founder's Journal' to evaluate past performance and brainstorm improvements. Together, they outline actionable initiatives to transition the audio diary into an omnichannel media brand through multi-streaming, structured preparation, and newsletter cross-promotion.

How this conversation actually went

Every chapter scored 0–10 on four independent dynamics. Hover any point for the reasoning behind the score. Alex holds 75.1% of the talking time here. How this is scored →

Alex as informed peer 5.7 Guest teaching 2.8 Guest disagreement 2.5 Alex pushing back 2.2
05100:0010:000:36–3:40 · Alex as informed peer 5/10 Reflecting on Show Origins and Download Milestones Alex and Josh review the origin of the podcast and estimate overall performance metrics. The tone is highly collaborative and aligned as Alex accurately deduces their historical download metrics.3:41–6:24 · Alex as informed peer 6/10 Assessing Core Strengths and Long-Term Program Goals Alex sets up a structured framework to audit what is working and introduces his dual long-term ambitions for the show. Josh enthusiastically supports the consistency thesis while teeing up potential disagreements on goal-setting.6:25–9:57 · Alex as informed peer 6/10 Debating Omnichannel Brand Growth Versus Audio Exclusivity Josh challenges Alex's podcast-only metric goal, arguing that defining success strictly by RSS feeds is flawed. Alex pushes back by defending single-channel audience focus before conceding YouTube's platform advantages.9:58–12:45 · Alex as informed peer 6/10 Identifying Gaps in Audience Engagement and Content Preparation Alex candidly outlines operational bottlenecks, including a lack of prep time and unclear audience value props. Josh prompts Alex to consider whether creator intent or audience feedback should drive the core premise.12:46–15:18 · Alex as informed peer 5/10 Brainstorming Multi-Streaming Distribution and Morning Brew Integration Alex details technical multi-streaming ideas, but Josh steps in to point out a major blind spot: failing to leverage Morning Brew's flagship newsletter audience. Alex acknowledges his hesitation and accepts Josh's proposal to run an experiment.15:18–17:26 · Alex as informed peer 6/10 Episode Synthesis and Call for Audience Feedback Alex provides a clear synthesis of the audit and actionable next steps. The segment wraps smoothly with a joint call-to-action inviting listener feedback directly via email.0:36–3:40 · Guest teaching 2/10 Reflecting on Show Origins and Download Milestones Alex and Josh review the origin of the podcast and estimate overall performance metrics. The tone is highly collaborative and aligned as Alex accurately deduces their historical download metrics.3:41–6:24 · Guest teaching 2/10 Assessing Core Strengths and Long-Term Program Goals Alex sets up a structured framework to audit what is working and introduces his dual long-term ambitions for the show. Josh enthusiastically supports the consistency thesis while teeing up potential disagreements on goal-setting.6:25–9:57 · Guest teaching 4/10 Debating Omnichannel Brand Growth Versus Audio Exclusivity Josh challenges Alex's podcast-only metric goal, arguing that defining success strictly by RSS feeds is flawed. Alex pushes back by defending single-channel audience focus before conceding YouTube's platform advantages.9:58–12:45 · Guest teaching 3/10 Identifying Gaps in Audience Engagement and Content Preparation Alex candidly outlines operational bottlenecks, including a lack of prep time and unclear audience value props. Josh prompts Alex to consider whether creator intent or audience feedback should drive the core premise.12:46–15:18 · Guest teaching 5/10 Brainstorming Multi-Streaming Distribution and Morning Brew Integration Alex details technical multi-streaming ideas, but Josh steps in to point out a major blind spot: failing to leverage Morning Brew's flagship newsletter audience. Alex acknowledges his hesitation and accepts Josh's proposal to run an experiment.15:18–17:26 · Guest teaching 1/10 Episode Synthesis and Call for Audience Feedback Alex provides a clear synthesis of the audit and actionable next steps. The segment wraps smoothly with a joint call-to-action inviting listener feedback directly via email.0:36–3:40 · Guest disagreement 1/10 Reflecting on Show Origins and Download Milestones Alex and Josh review the origin of the podcast and estimate overall performance metrics. The tone is highly collaborative and aligned as Alex accurately deduces their historical download metrics.3:41–6:24 · Guest disagreement 2/10 Assessing Core Strengths and Long-Term Program Goals Alex sets up a structured framework to audit what is working and introduces his dual long-term ambitions for the show. Josh enthusiastically supports the consistency thesis while teeing up potential disagreements on goal-setting.6:25–9:57 · Guest disagreement 5/10 Debating Omnichannel Brand Growth Versus Audio Exclusivity Josh challenges Alex's podcast-only metric goal, arguing that defining success strictly by RSS feeds is flawed. Alex pushes back by defending single-channel audience focus before conceding YouTube's platform advantages.9:58–12:45 · Guest disagreement 2/10 Identifying Gaps in Audience Engagement and Content Preparation Alex candidly outlines operational bottlenecks, including a lack of prep time and unclear audience value props. Josh prompts Alex to consider whether creator intent or audience feedback should drive the core premise.12:46–15:18 · Guest disagreement 4/10 Brainstorming Multi-Streaming Distribution and Morning Brew Integration Alex details technical multi-streaming ideas, but Josh steps in to point out a major blind spot: failing to leverage Morning Brew's flagship newsletter audience. Alex acknowledges his hesitation and accepts Josh's proposal to run an experiment.15:18–17:26 · Guest disagreement 1/10 Episode Synthesis and Call for Audience Feedback Alex provides a clear synthesis of the audit and actionable next steps. The segment wraps smoothly with a joint call-to-action inviting listener feedback directly via email.0:36–3:40 · Alex pushing back 1/10 Reflecting on Show Origins and Download Milestones Alex and Josh review the origin of the podcast and estimate overall performance metrics. The tone is highly collaborative and aligned as Alex accurately deduces their historical download metrics.3:41–6:24 · Alex pushing back 2/10 Assessing Core Strengths and Long-Term Program Goals Alex sets up a structured framework to audit what is working and introduces his dual long-term ambitions for the show. Josh enthusiastically supports the consistency thesis while teeing up potential disagreements on goal-setting.6:25–9:57 · Alex pushing back 5/10 Debating Omnichannel Brand Growth Versus Audio Exclusivity Josh challenges Alex's podcast-only metric goal, arguing that defining success strictly by RSS feeds is flawed. Alex pushes back by defending single-channel audience focus before conceding YouTube's platform advantages.9:58–12:45 · Alex pushing back 2/10 Identifying Gaps in Audience Engagement and Content Preparation Alex candidly outlines operational bottlenecks, including a lack of prep time and unclear audience value props. Josh prompts Alex to consider whether creator intent or audience feedback should drive the core premise.12:46–15:18 · Alex pushing back 2/10 Brainstorming Multi-Streaming Distribution and Morning Brew Integration Alex details technical multi-streaming ideas, but Josh steps in to point out a major blind spot: failing to leverage Morning Brew's flagship newsletter audience. Alex acknowledges his hesitation and accepts Josh's proposal to run an experiment.15:18–17:26 · Alex pushing back 1/10 Episode Synthesis and Call for Audience Feedback Alex provides a clear synthesis of the audit and actionable next steps. The segment wraps smoothly with a joint call-to-action inviting listener feedback directly via email.

speaking balance: gold is Alex, purple is the guest (3 minute bins)

0:00 · Alex 63.3% · guest 36.7%0:00 · Alex 63.3% · guest 36.7%3:00 · Alex 87% · guest 13%3:00 · Alex 87% · guest 13%6:00 · Alex 55.8% · guest 44.2%6:00 · Alex 55.8% · guest 44.2%9:00 · Alex 83.9% · guest 16.1%9:00 · Alex 83.9% · guest 16.1%12:00 · Alex 81.4% · guest 18.6%12:00 · Alex 81.4% · guest 18.6%15:00 · Alex 79.6% · guest 20.4%15:00 · Alex 79.6% · guest 20.4%
Sharpest disagreement ▶ 6:50 Rejecting the RSS download benchmark

Josh directly challenges Alex's core goal, asserting that focusing solely on podcast downloads will lead to failure rather than treating the show as a multi-channel brand.

 Hardest push from Alex ▶ 7:43 Defending single-channel initial focus

Alex pushes back on Josh's broad brand argument by explaining that mastering a single channel first establishes the permission and leverage needed to expand multi-channel.

 Biggest teaching moment ▶ 14:04 Calling out the overlooked flagship newsletter

Josh educates Alex on distribution prioritization by pointing out that Morning Brew's multi-million subscriber newsletter remains entirely untapped for promoting the show.

 Alex holds their own ▶ 8:52 Strategic comparison of YouTube versus podcast tooling

Alex demonstrates strong media operator expertise by detailing why YouTube's superior creator analytics and opt-in mechanics make it a more powerful acquisition channel than RSS.
the scores for every segment, with the reasoning behind each
ChapterTopicAlex as informed peerGuest teachingGuest disagreementAlex pushing backWhy
Reflecting on Show Origins and Download Milestones 5211 Alex and Josh review the origin of the podcast and estimate overall performance metrics. The tone is highly collaborative and aligned as Alex accurately deduces their historical download metrics.
Assessing Core Strengths and Long-Term Program Goals 6222 Alex sets up a structured framework to audit what is working and introduces his dual long-term ambitions for the show. Josh enthusiastically supports the consistency thesis while teeing up potential disagreements on goal-setting.
Debating Omnichannel Brand Growth Versus Audio Exclusivity 6455 Josh challenges Alex's podcast-only metric goal, arguing that defining success strictly by RSS feeds is flawed. Alex pushes back by defending single-channel audience focus before conceding YouTube's platform advantages.
Identifying Gaps in Audience Engagement and Content Preparation 6322 Alex candidly outlines operational bottlenecks, including a lack of prep time and unclear audience value props. Josh prompts Alex to consider whether creator intent or audience feedback should drive the core premise.
Brainstorming Multi-Streaming Distribution and Morning Brew Integration 5542 Alex details technical multi-streaming ideas, but Josh steps in to point out a major blind spot: failing to leverage Morning Brew's flagship newsletter audience. Alex acknowledges his hesitation and accepts Josh's proposal to run an experiment.
Episode Synthesis and Call for Audience Feedback 6111 Alex provides a clear synthesis of the audit and actionable next steps. The segment wraps smoothly with a joint call-to-action inviting listener feedback directly via email.

Statements from this episode (8)

Assertion Not checkable as stated
Advertisers sought to sponsor Founder's Journal within weeks of launch
“In the last three weeks, there have been advertisers asking to sponsor Founders Journal, which I think is pretty amazing.”
Alex Lieberman Aug 19, 2020 ▶ 5:39
Insight
Kaplan: Founder's Journal must grow beyond just a podcast to succeed
“If we only focus on the podcast numbers, we will fail. We have to look at founders journal as a brand. And as you, as a show, not as a podcast”
Josh Kaplan Aug 19, 2020 ▶ 6:53
Insight
Lieberman: Mastering a single channel earns permission to go multi-channel
“By focusing on a single channel brand, it gives you the permission to build a multi-channel franchise because you're kind of, I think in a good way, putting all of your eggs in one basket to build up an audience in a place and then start creating content in ot…”
Alex Lieberman Aug 19, 2020 ▶ 8:07
Opinion
Lieberman: YouTube offers more powerful audience data than podcast platforms
“The tools for creators on YouTube are far more sophisticated right now. I believe, and I could be wrong in this, that you can capture more information from a YouTube audience than a podcast audience. And so I think we can always drive people to listening to th…”
Alex Lieberman Aug 19, 2020 ▶ 9:09
Disclosure
Lieberman initially started Founder's Journal as a personal time capsule
“I honestly started the show with you selfishly to document the experience for myself. Now that people are listening to it. And my hope always was that people will get value out of it. But like the primary goal we started was to create a time capsule.”
Alex Lieberman Aug 19, 2020 ▶ 11:04
Disclosure
Morning Brew had never promoted Founder's Journal in its flagship newsletter
“We have not plugged it in our newsletter at all.”
Alex Lieberman Aug 19, 2020 ▶ 14:26
Assertion Supported
Morning Brew's newsletter reached over two million readers by August 2020
“Like if that, that is that the hypothesis we can test it and then by accident get the show in front of two point, whatever million readers.”
Josh Kaplan Aug 19, 2020 ▶ 15:03
Assertion Not checkable as stated
Founder's Journal had just 22,000 total downloads across its first 63 episodes
“So we have now done 63 episodes of the Founders Journal. It has 22,000 downloads.”
Alex Lieberman Aug 19, 2020 ▶ 15:27
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